Most people care about animals, but only a tiny fraction are vegan. The rest often think of veganism as an extreme position. They certainly do not believe that they have a moral obligation to become vegan. In his new book, Why Veganism Matters, Gary Francione, a leading scholar of animal rights theory and law, argues that there is a contradiction in thinking that animals matter morally if one is also not vegan, and he explains why this belief should logically lead all who hold it to veganism. If animals matter morally, they must have the right not to be used as property. That means that we cannot eat them, wear them, use them, or otherwise treat them as resources or commodities. This conversation with Francione will explore the idea that veganism is a moral imperative and a matter of justice.

Gary Francione is Distinguished Professor of Law and Nicholas deB. Katzenbach Scholar of Law and Philosophy at Rutgers University Law School. He is well known throughout the animal protection movement for his criticism of animal welfare law and the property status of nonhuman animals, and for his theory of animal rights. His new book, Why Veganism Matters: The Moral Value of Animals, is published in January. @garylfrancione

Adam Ferner has worked in academic philosophy both in France and the UK, but much prefers working outside academia in youth centres and other alternative learning spaces. He has published widely in philosophical and popular journals and is currently writing his fifth book, Philosophical Empire with Chris Meyns, forthcoming later this year. He is an associate editor of the Forum’s Essays, and a member of the Changelings, a North London fiction collaboration. adamferner.com

Darren Chetty is a writer and Teaching Fellow at University College London. He has published academic work on philosophy, education, racism, children’s literature and hip-hop culture. His latest book (co-written with Adam Ferner) How to Disagree: Negotiate Difference in a Divided Worldwas published last year. @rapclassroom